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Post by canada on Jun 11, 2019 14:32:37 GMT -6
Westminster Confession Of Faith article 26, 5
There is no other Head of the Church but the Lord Jesus Christ, nor can the Pope of Rome, in any sense be head thereof, but is that Antichrist that man of sin and son of perdition, that exalteth himself in the Church against Christ, and all that is called God.
Eph 1:22, Col 1:18, Mat 23:8-10, 2 Thes 2:3-4, 8-9, Rev 13:6
The "Vicar Of Christ" (vicarious) places himself ... "in the place of" Christ ... "instead of" Christ. That is blasphemy. He sits in his "temple" claiming to be ... as God.
The language of Romanism is ... Latin ... I V X L C D = 666
This "religion" is throughout the world (Rome universal) for that is the meaning of "catholic".
And call no man your father, for one is your Father, which is in heaven. Mathew 23:9 Have you wondered why this verse is in the Word, and who it points to?
What "religion" calls it's priests ... Father? What "religion" calls the head of it's church ... Holy Father?
Case closed.
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Post by venge on Jun 12, 2019 7:01:43 GMT -6
Westminster Confession Of Faith article 26, 5
There is no other Head of the Church but the Lord Jesus Christ, nor can the Pope of Rome, in any sense be head thereof, but is that Antichrist that man of sin and son of perdition, that exalteth himself in the Church against Christ, and all that is called God.
Eph 1:22, Col 1:18, Mat 23:8-10, 2 Thes 2:3-4, 8-9, Rev 13:6
The "Vicar Of Christ" (vicarious) places himself ... "in the place of" Christ ... "instead of" Christ. That is blasphemy. He sits in his "temple" claiming to be ... as God.
The language of Romanism is ... Latin ... I V X L C D = 666
This "religion" is throughout the world (Rome universal) for that is the meaning of "catholic".
And call no man your father, for one is your Father, which is in heaven. Mathew 23:9 Have you wondered why this verse is in the Word, and who it points to?
What "religion" calls it's priests ... Father? What "religion" calls the head of it's church ... Holy Father?
Case closed.
I call my dad father..so? Relating sinful behavior to a Church, are there perfect Churches out there or 1 Church that has everything right to a T? No, there is not. I could say prosperity gospel distorts truth and must be anti christ Or Latter Day Saints must be, or Islam, what about witches? Using Father as a title may be wrong because of its intent towards almighty God, but a sin hardly qualifies as a good reason beyond a reasonable doubt for the mark of the beast. |
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Post by canada on Jun 12, 2019 17:51:17 GMT -6
From your comments, it sounds like you are being protective of the Church of Rome.
1. Are you a protestant?
2. Are you saying that the Westminster divines were wrong regarding the papacy?
3. In that the language of the Church of Rome is Latin ... do you believe it a mere coincidence that the original six Roman numbers I V X L C D sum at 666?
4. Regarding Mathew 23:9 and "father", do you believe it a coincidence that the Church of Rome addresses it's priests and popes as Father and Holy Father?
5. You refer to your dad as father and say "so what". Is it that difficult to follow the Bible regarding this passage ... and, do you not see it's relevance to prophecy?
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Post by boraddict on Jun 12, 2019 19:52:45 GMT -6
Venge you are in trouble now! Canada is on top of the Catholic angle.
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Post by venge on Jun 13, 2019 9:55:05 GMT -6
From your comments, it sounds like you are being protective of the Church of Rome. 1. Are you a protestant? 2. Are you saying that the Westminster divines were wrong regarding the papacy? 3. In that the language of the Church of Rome is Latin ... do you believe it a mere coincidence that the original six Roman numbers I V X L C D sum at 666? 4. Regarding Mathew 23:9 and "father", do you believe it a coincidence that the Church of Rome addresses it's priests and popes as Father and Holy Father? 5. You refer to your dad as father and say "so what". Is it that difficult to follow the Bible regarding this passage ... and, do you not see it's relevance to prophecy? 1. I am Christian. Follower of Christ testimony and almighty God. 2. Many that believe have been wrong on many different things. 3. Coincidence, yep! Everything needed to understand the Bible is found IN THE BIBLE. Not in the world or Catholic dogma/policies and beliefs. 4. I don’t care what word they choose as it does not effect my relationship with God. We can only teach truth and read truth. We are responsible for ourselves and others by saving their souls. Ref. To “father” to me as some missing link to the mark of the beast doesn’t hold enough weight. It is not enough to persuade. 5. I don’t see the passage refer to Roman Catholics. I do not see the relevance, no..not any. |
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Post by canada on Jun 13, 2019 19:44:50 GMT -6
From your comments, it sounds like you are being protective of the Church of Rome. 1. Are you a protestant? 2. Are you saying that the Westminster divines were wrong regarding the papacy? 3. In that the language of the Church of Rome is Latin ... do you believe it a mere coincidence that the original six Roman numbers I V X L C D sum at 666? 4. Regarding Mathew 23:9 and "father", do you believe it a coincidence that the Church of Rome addresses it's priests and popes as Father and Holy Father? 5. You refer to your dad as father and say "so what". Is it that difficult to follow the Bible regarding this passage ... and, do you not see it's relevance to prophecy? 1. I am Christian. Follower of Christ testimony and almighty God. 2. Many that believe have been wrong on many different things. 3. Coincidence, yep! Everything needed to understand the Bible is found IN THE BIBLE. Not in the world or Catholic dogma/policies and beliefs. 4. I don’t care what word they choose as it does not effect my relationship with God. We can only teach truth and read truth. We are responsible for ourselves and others by saving their souls. Ref. To “father” to me as some missing link to the mark of the beast doesn’t hold enough weight. It is not enough to persuade. 5. I don’t see the passage refer to Roman Catholics. I do not see the relevance, no..not any. |
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Post by canada on Jun 13, 2019 19:53:29 GMT -6
1. I am Christian. Follower of Christ testimony and almighty God. 2. Many that believe have been wrong on many different things. 3. Coincidence, yep! Everything needed to understand the Bible is found IN THE BIBLE. Not in the world or Catholic dogma/policies and beliefs. 4. I don’t care what word they choose as it does not effect my relationship with God. We can only teach truth and read truth. We are responsible for ourselves and others by saving their souls. Ref. To “father” to me as some missing link to the mark of the beast doesn’t hold enough weight. It is not enough to persuade. 5. I don’t see the passage refer to Roman Catholics. I do not see the relevance, no..not any. As a 40 year student of prophecy, I find your conclusions mind boggling, but so be it. Thank you.
Are there others following this thread that agree with Venge's conclusions?
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Post by cwood85 on Jun 13, 2019 20:20:32 GMT -6
As a 40 year student of prophecy, I find your conclusions mind boggling, but so be it. Thank you.
Are there others following this thread that agree with Venge's conclusions?
I do more or less but maybe in a much broader spectrum. I do not believe there is one sole religion that has anything to do with the mark of the beast, but my views on the mark of the beast are not what is in line with mainstream prophecy either. We we are told what the number represents, man. Not a singular man which is the Greek word Aner, but in the Greek it is mankind. The word is 444 ánthrōpos – man, also the generic term for " mankind"; the human race; people, including women and men. It is also the transliteration of the Hebrew word for mankind, Adam. The mark of the beast is the result of a beast system, a system of mankind. This can be in the form of religion, governments, politics, money, banking and monetary systems, corporations and so on. Ever wonder why it is always the face of a man that is imprinted on money? How long has that been happening for? Thousands of years. Why is this done? Why has it always been done to have a rulers or image of a particular individual on money? There isn’t a single religion God is going to pull out of the many as worse than another. Why? Because essentially they all do they same thing. Teach or convert people to believe that they can, should or better follow said religions rules for salvation by works and rituals. In an essence this is based on ones pride in their ability to follow the rules of said religion to gain or ensure their salvation. So this would mean there isn’t a single religion that will be responsible for the mark of the beast or taking ones place in the temple of God. |
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Post by boraddict on Jun 13, 2019 20:59:13 GMT -6
As a 40 year student of prophecy, I find your conclusions mind boggling, but so be it. Thank you.
Are there others following this thread that agree with Venge's conclusions?
Hi Canada. It may be the case that some misunderstandings are in the semantics of the conversation. So what perspective (doctrine) are both you and venge coming from? It may be the case that the word "father" is the issue? My friend's son calls him "papa" and that is the base word for pope. So it seems that pope means father. Thus, by the very act of calling Francis "pope" means that he is being addressed as father. More than that, the Catholics call all their priests "father" and that is very strange. So I think the violation to God's law exists in that one man or woman or children calling someone their father that is not their direct male relative in the family unit. You know, like someone stepping into the place that only God holds as our Father. Yet, God himself has provided men to be the male parent of children in the family. So what do we call these men but dad, papa, etc. Nevertheless, these male members of a family unit are not functioning as placeholders of God. Whereas, the priests and religious leaders do place themselves in that capacity. So there appears to be a distinction between the two. On one hand the adult male member of the family that is caring for his children is called what? Then on the other hand the ones pretending to represent God in the capacity of the head of the family of God is in violation of the law. So there is one God the Father and no representatives to stand in for him. There is also the male member of the family unit that presides over that family unit. In both cases they are dads. One over the family of God, and the other over the individual family unit that includes a mother and children. However, the pretenders, as in the ones who claim to represent God, are in violation of the law; but not those in the individual family unit. So what do we call them but dad, papa, etc. |
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Post by mike on Jun 13, 2019 21:17:45 GMT -6
I believe there are many solid arguments for Catholicism having a major role in the final decline of mankind. I also have heard sound backing in support of Islam being the seat of Anti-Christ.
Further I know some with strong conviction about the man of sin being within each and everyone of us. This too has scriptural evidence.
Luciferians, AI, the list goes on...
In order to for me to not miss the signs of His return I watch in all directions, never focusing too intently in one direction else I miss something outside my stare.
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Post by mike on Jun 13, 2019 21:22:37 GMT -6
Funny cwood85 I had my post sitting in my phone for at least an hour and forgot to click reply, yet we basically said the same thing. Or at least I read your post as similar to what I was (trying) to say |
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Post by davewatchman on Jun 14, 2019 6:22:18 GMT -6
Congratulations on your 666 post. And a great one at that.  As a 40 year student of prophecy, I find your conclusions mind boggling, but so be it. Thank you.
Are there others following this thread that agree with Venge's conclusions?
Hi Canada. It may be the case that some misunderstandings are in the semantics of the conversation. So what perspective (doctrine) are both you and venge coming from? It may be the case that the word "father" is the issue? My friend's son calls him "papa" and that is the base word for pope. So it seems that pope means father. Thus, by the very act of calling Francis "pope" means that he is being addressed as father. More than that, the Catholics call all their priests "father" and that is very strange. So I think the violation to God's law exists in that one man or woman or children calling someone their father that is not their direct male relative in the family unit. You know, like someone stepping into the place that only God holds as our Father. Yet, God himself has provided men to be the male parent of children in the family. So what do we call these men but dad, papa, etc. Nevertheless, these male members of a family unit are not functioning as placeholders of God. Whereas, the priests and religious leaders do place themselves in that capacity. So there appears to be a distinction between the two. On one hand the adult male member of the family that is caring for his children is called what? Then on the other hand the ones pretending to represent God in the capacity of the head of the family of God is in violation of the law. So there is one God the Father and no representatives to stand in for him. There is also the male member of the family unit that presides over that family unit. In both cases they are dads. One over the family of God, and the other over the individual family unit that includes a mother and children. However, the pretenders, as in the ones who claim to represent God, are in violation of the law; but not those in the individual family unit. So what do we call them but dad, papa, etc. Well said. Like when we read Matthew 23, Jesus is talking about the pharisees. The subject matter is religious teachers, not our paternal "fathers". Forgive me father, for I have sinned
 What a deal. Sounds like a fishy deal right off the bat. Sounds like a fish head hat. I knew you'd like that. I guess that i'm leaning more towards canada's team on this. Though i hate to take sides. Team Canada has a nice ring. Only God can forgive sin, not a man wearing a fish head hat. Though he might THINK to change times and the law and the Lord's Prayer. But ultimately, looking at the big picture, i think that the capital "A" Antichrist is the Devil himself. The popery is just that 6th head on the composite beast that was mortally wounded by Napoleon's sword in 1798, and yet he lives today. The number of a man, is this the "man" that made the nations tremble, is the number of his name. Which is destruction. His name means destruction, the son of destruction, the son of perdition. The number of humanity that he will take with him to his destruction. Two thirds, 666. Peace be with you. |
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Post by venge on Jun 14, 2019 8:05:56 GMT -6
I think if you take the beast as a man and not a kingdom, you will always get a different interpretation.
I have always maintained the definition broken down is “the numerous assemblage of mankind.”
It is multiple nations coming together in great prosperity and treating others hostile. Putting a heavy yoke on your neighbor, great love of money, persecuting others etc
Daniel is very specific that the fourth beast of the sea is a kingdom and this beast is the one the false prophet makes an image of. The beast that was slain and yet lives or the kingdom thought destroyed because of wickedness yet it comes back because men are wicked
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Post by stormyknight on Jun 14, 2019 8:06:15 GMT -6
canada , I still hold that the characteristics of the 'woman sitting on a scarlet beast' Rev. 17:3, and the catholic church are, in my mind, incontrovertible. A child could make this comparison swiftly and easily. There are other aspects as well, like the Julian and Gregorian calendars and the ten commandments, "...shall seek to change the times and the law." Dan. 7:25. But, I don't think that the pope is the anti-Christ. I think the catholic church is the main part of the beast system that rules the earth as per The satan's power. As I've posted elsewhere, I believe there are many satans/adversaries and then there is THE satan. As mike pointed out, we are all capable of being an adversary, even Peter was called satan by Christ, Himself. It's just a label. But I think the Prince of Darkness is the one who gives his power to the beast and the catholic church is a major part of that system. As far as the mark of the beast being something related to, or issued, or made mandatory, by the catholic church, I'm still on the fence about. fwiw, I was raised in a fairly strict catholic family.
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Post by stormyknight on Jun 14, 2019 8:14:43 GMT -6
btw, davewatchman , that piece you posted about the confessional... "TRIGGERED!!!"
Just kidding. Every time I 'have' to go to a catholic mass, like for a funeral or wedding, all the old rituals come flooding back and I want to run out screaming. 
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