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Post by Gary on Aug 24, 2017 15:41:41 GMT -6
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Post by rt on Aug 24, 2017 17:27:13 GMT -6
I am not suggesting that we can pin down precisely when the rapture will happen but I do believe we can get a general sense as it draws near and that we should live in light of that day and its imminence, being "on guard":
Thank you Gary for sharing your insights.
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Post by mike on Aug 24, 2017 17:40:32 GMT -6
Gary thank you! I haven't read the article yet but I "know" what it says. I came across something interesting in Luke 12:56 "ye hypocrites, ye can discern the face of the sky and of the Earth; but how is it that ye do not discern this time." But compare to Matt 16:4 "A wicked and adulterous generation seeketh after a sign; and there shall no sign be given u to it but the sign of the prophet Jonah..."
I suppose the difference here is that Luke didn't record the piece that Matt did (verse 4).
We are looking at a multitude of signs. I don't think we (believers) fall into the "wicked generation" category. But then who is he addressing? Is it only the Pharisees from 2000 yrs ago?
EDIT - read it this morning...good stuff Gary!!! Thank you for a concise, to the point, well thought out and scriptural explanation of the end times timing. We certainly can know and should be able to discern the time.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 24, 2017 21:47:59 GMT -6
I have asked all my 4 chlldren, now with children of their own, what it might mean if I said "Let's split the scene!".........not a single one knew what I was talking about....we lost the meaning of an idiom of the 60's and 70's in English in one generation.
If we can lose the meaning of an idiom in American English in one generation, how much more so can we lose meaning from a Jewish idiom in Aramaic referring to Yom Teruah translated to the king's English today?
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Post by sawdy on Aug 24, 2017 22:11:52 GMT -6
Great job! I have shared it.
I too, have been told "no one knows the day or hour" and "he will come like a thief in the night" by many of my Christian friends. Those two sayings are really a catchall scapegoat for actually reading and studying and prophecy in the Bible. By falling into the trap of believing those sayings, you are stuck in Christian-lite where it is all feel good on how to live a nice life. I am glad I didn't drink the Christian-lite.
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Post by watchmanjim on Aug 26, 2017 11:36:07 GMT -6
Hebrews 10:25 Not forsaking the assembling of ourselves together, as the manner of some is; but exhorting one another: and so much the more, as ye see the day approaching. As ye see the day approaching As ye see the day approaching As ye see the day approaching As ye see the day approaching As ye see the day approaching (poof)
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Post by whatif on Aug 26, 2017 11:49:43 GMT -6
I love it, watchmanjim! I suspect we are heading toward the Poof!
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Post by sawdy on Aug 26, 2017 20:12:55 GMT -6
Hebrews 10:25 Not forsaking the assembling of ourselves together, as the manner of some is; but exhorting one another: and so much the more, as ye see the day approaching. As ye see the day approaching As ye see the day approaching As ye see the day approaching As ye see the day approaching As ye see the day approaching (poof)There should be a meme of this. Lol
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Post by Connie on Aug 27, 2017 12:59:55 GMT -6
It's a wonderful article, Gary. All the vitriol and hubris from the prophecy teachers doesn't make a lick of sense. They should be thrilled! And how many times have you heard that crowd warn against pulling proof texts without doing your own research and looking at context and dadgum if there not doing the same thing.
I loved Marzulli's take on it (with that twinkle in his eye)-- "I don't know-- but it's exciting!"
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Post by watchman35 on Aug 27, 2017 14:10:16 GMT -6
As I have said more than once before, it is not difficult for me to imagine that there will be some folks who, if possible, will be clinging to their mantra of "No man knows the day or the hour" even as they are being lifted from the earth to meet the Lord in the air... Just came across this Barry Scarborough video on YouTube, which I thought was very good in making the case against the traditionally accepted interpretation of "no man knows the day or the hour." However, the one thing that Barry neglected to include in his presentation is the fact that both the church and the rapture are, at the time of Matthew 24, unrevealed mysteries that the disciples knew nothing about. They did not know about either of these concepts until AFTER Jesus had been resurrected and ascended. Context...context...context. Jewish Messiah speaking to Jewish disciples who, at the time of the conversation, knew nothing about either the church or the rapture. Makes it more than a little difficult to make a convincing case that Jesus was referring to the rapture when He said, "No man knows the day or the hour." Just sayin'. Anyway, I found this message from Barry to be very worthwhile listening to.
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Post by watchmanjim on Aug 27, 2017 23:08:33 GMT -6
He also mentioned my contribution. Also, W35, was this portion of Scripture before or after Jesus told Peter that upon this rock He would build His church?
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Post by watchman35 on Aug 28, 2017 18:35:50 GMT -6
Good point watchmanjim. I think I may be wrong on that point about the church being a complete mystery at that time. I was thinking more specifically about the gentile aspect of the church, but the scripture you bring up does come before Matthew 24. This gets a little fuzzy to me when I think of the conception of the church at Pentecost and the disciples seemingly having no real concept of what that would be like at the time of the Olivet discourse. However, even if the church argument I initially made is not valid, it still seems to me that the entire concept of the rapture remains a mystery at that time and could not possibly be what the Lord is speaking about to the disciples in Matthew 24. Matthew 24 has been a chapter I have wrestled with for many years, but I believe it is strictly a Jewish context that has been misinterpreted by many (including me at various times and in various ways).
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Post by watchmanjim on Aug 29, 2017 0:50:40 GMT -6
Well, it's pretty clear that the disciples were fairly confused about all the future events until after the resurrection of our Lord.
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Post by disciple4life on Aug 30, 2017 1:33:12 GMT -6
Gary, I'm a fellow-watchman, a missionary in former nazi Germany, now Western Poland, and certainly one of your biggest fans. I deeply respect your work and research,, along with several other prophecy teachers like rabbi Mark Biltz and Amir Tsarfati and Perry Stone. I have even shared your posts with family and close friends. I'm not a nay-sayer, - I'm even giving a sermon on the feasts, in the coming weeks. I want to be like the Bereans - who study the word to see that these things are true. There are so many signs and events that all line up this Sept like never before. One great verse that really seems to apply here - Is Colos 2:16-17. Colossians 2:16-17New International Version (NIV) 16 Therefore do not let anyone judge you by what you eat or drink, or with regard to a religious festival, a New Moon celebration or a Sabbath day. 17 These are a shadow of the things that were to come; the reality, however, is found in Christ. Wow. It says New Moon - It only just occurred to me that this is FOT -- no other feast. This is the only one of the 7 that is on the New Moon. ;-) Also, Paul is linking all the feasts to Messiah. Also interesting that all the feasts have to be done in order. Can't rejoice [Feast of Booths - Sukkot] until we have been Redeemed. Can't be redeemed [Day of Atonement - Yom Kippur] until we repent. [Feast of Trumpets - Yom Teruah] !! Could you, Gary, or any other watchman, please provide any link, or source of Jewish [Non-Christian] confirmation of this idiom?? It totally makes sense [No one knows the day or the hour, - lunar cycle, and it's hard to see, sometime cloudy, etc] but i can't find any Jewish evidence to corroborate this idiom. I've even contacted multiple rabbis, and asked them.. I've also searched on google. All i get are the same messianic rabbis and prophecy teachers. Blessings, Gary, We are watching and awake, looking and praying earnestly for the Second Advent. Maranatha.
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Post by whatif on Aug 30, 2017 9:33:56 GMT -6
Good morning, disciple4life! Welcome to the forum!
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