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Post by Deleted on Sept 1, 2017 8:32:01 GMT -6
Just reading over my recent note, I'm noticing my mentioning the word "law" a few times. It should be noted, that I see the law as the character of God. It is sort of like his DNA. His written law is a very small token of the actual law that makes up his character. And all of the actual law coalesces into love.
To have his law written on our hearts does not mean we learn to obey the written law. It means our heart changes to be more like the heart of God. We do not "obey" per se. We do what we want to do and it happens to be what God wants us to do. This happens this way as we come into conformity with God.
Hope that clears that up.
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Post by mike on Sept 1, 2017 8:35:51 GMT -6
Thank you SK ... You explained that very simply for a simpleton like me!
This was especially meaningful to me "God does not stop with us at our passover experience. He then refines us with his fiery law in our lives and brings us into accord with this will and law(character)." In sharing faith/truth with others they often say, "yeah I believe in Jesus" but they also believe in this or that, or accept things of this world (sins) as ok. As I said in another post to MissusMack about challenging people to think. This made me think and how simple it is to point out to folks that believing in God and accepting other things are at emnity! Pointing that out puts us and others in a position, a valley of decision.
(^^^this makes sense to me, if no one else, you have helped me a bunch already today)
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Post by yardstick on Sept 1, 2017 9:47:14 GMT -6
I can add a little color here. In regard to the jewish traditions, I have typically not introduced them into my family's celebrations. Although, they can be enlightening, one never knows if they are dependable as true representations of the appointed times of God and therefore, they are interesting, but not dependable. However, I have also heard about the bride capture idea. As far as the “fulfillment” of the feasts. We often teach that the feasts have an eventual fulfillment, but in my experience and study, this is not the case - instead, they are appointed times. If you consider a watch and pick a time along the circumference of the watch you could say that is an appointed time. For example, you may have an appointment at 7:34. This is a recurring appointed time. We see that throughout scripture key events took place on the various feast days. So the feasts have “fulfillments” over and over again. Yes, some very major events also took place on these days and that is where we get the idea that they are fulfilled on those events, but the minor events between those major events are also interesting. Back to our watch, if we picked an actual point instead of a time, you would see the second hand pass that point, the big hand, and the little hand. Each time a hand passes the point it is a testimony to some truth about that point (or better, about the watch maker) - the second hand passing would be a minor testimony and the little hand (hour hand) would be a major testimony. The circular nature of the appointed times is why prophecy has multiple fulfillments. It is unclear to me if this will continue or if at some point, the feasts are considered fully fulfilled. Then our celebration of them would be purely for remembrance. I’ll add some more info in the next post, but I need to take care of a couple things around the house so it will be about 30 minutes. Stay tuned though, cause it gets interesting! This fits nicely into the notion that the universe (solar system et al.) is a clock. |
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Post by yardstick on Sept 1, 2017 9:50:22 GMT -6
A subset of Christianity, for lack of a better name I'll call them "seekers", have come to an understanding that the feasts are God's appointed times and that they hold significance in the timing of His fulfillment of certain aspects of His plan. But the seekers are still often unaware of all the minor events that have taken place on feast days throughout the scriptures, history, and their own personal lives. This is part of the blessing of celebrating the feasts. It sort of "set's your clock" to the timing of God. And yet, there is an even deeper application of the feasts that even avid seekers often miss - most seekers recognize the role of the feasts in prophecy and in the corporate body of christ. But did you also know that the feasts are internal as well? Each individual lives out the feasts in his/her own salvation and walk with the Lord. Each of us, at some point claims the blood of the lamb over our lives (Passover), we recognize the futility of our own works(unleavened bread), we then give testimony to our faith through baptism (death and resurrection (First Fruits)). Now we begin to walk out our life submitting ourselves to the Lord and allowing his fiery law to be burned within our hearts (pentecost). Our debts are covered but need to be removed so we rise again(trumpets) and having escaped the second death(atonement) receive our glorified bodies(tabernacles-last great day). This is where I believe so many christian arguments start about salvation and once saved and works and lordship and all that stuff. You see there is a simple statement that spells it out: We have been saved(passover). We are being saved(pentecost). We will be saved(tabernacles). All of it is a work of Christ. God does not stop with us at our passover experience. He then refines us with his fiery law in our lives and brings us into accord with this will and law(character). This is why the pentecost feast is between passover and tabernacles and why it is the feast with a long delay before and after. You see God does not just save us for the next age, he is also saving us for this age so we can live in his joy now. So we can demonstrate his character through our love. So we can live abundantly and serve him as tenants of the gifts and resources he has given us. But eventually this body needs to put on the incorruptible and so we need to give up our temporary "booth" and receive our new body and this happens when our flesh is fully circumcised on the 8th day of tabernacles. God is so perfect in his ways that he has created a model that works from the very internals of each of us to the universal level. And I am guessing that once we see more fully we may find out that this model is even more grand then we I just illustrated. Amazing analysis. |
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Post by yardstick on Sept 1, 2017 9:52:26 GMT -6
Thanks SK! Get out the Crayola I brought my crayons too! |
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Post by watchmanjim on Sept 1, 2017 10:07:42 GMT -6
I made a thoughtful reply and then my internet got unplugged before I hit send, and i lost it. Anyway, this thread has been an encouragement.  |
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Post by Rick on Sept 1, 2017 17:11:12 GMT -6
A subset of Christianity, for lack of a better name I'll call them "seekers", have come to an understanding that the feasts are God's appointed times and that they hold significance in the timing of His fulfillment of certain aspects of His plan. Amazing analysis. That is an awesome way to see it. I enjoyed reading it very much silentknight. Thank you for posting it God Bless~ 2Ti 2:15 |
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Post by rt on Sept 1, 2017 19:36:31 GMT -6
I'm not well versed on the feasts but a question comes to mind so I wonder if anyone has some insight on this, perhaps SK does? Why were the feasts fulfilled the way they were? Why the spring feasts but not the fall? I understand the Passover feast had to be fulfilled when it was. Why wasnt Trumpets or Sukkot fulfilled at the Lords birth? I could probably research this but hey, it would take a long time to learn what some of you already know I am pretty sure Jesus fulfilled all the feasts, not just those in spring, though He did not necessarily fulfill them on their feast days. He certainly fulfilled the Day of Atonement, scripture is pretty clear about this, just read Hebrews 9-12. There is strong evidence that He may have been born during the feast of tabernacles, and as far as the day of "blowing" (AKA Trumpets) He is the trumpet that stands before God as a reminder for us. However, He may also fulfill the feasts again in the future as a testimony to the Jews. |
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Post by rt on Sept 1, 2017 19:38:04 GMT -6
This is an awesome observation!
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Post by mike on Sept 1, 2017 20:45:56 GMT -6
I am pretty sure Jesus fulfilled all the feasts, not just those in spring, though He did not necessarily fulfill them on their feast days. He certainly fulfilled the Day of Atonement, scripture is pretty clear about this, just read Hebrews 9-12. There is strong evidence that He may have been born during the feast of tabernacles, and as far as the day of "blowing" (AKA Trumpets) He is the trumpet that stands before God as a reminder for us. However, He may also fulfill the feasts again in the future as a testimony to the Jews. If the feasts have been fulfilled, I think the great sign loses some of punch. It holds more weight filling a feast. Just thought about this |
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Post by whatif on Sept 1, 2017 21:17:16 GMT -6
We often teach that the feasts have an eventual fulfillment, but in my experience and study, this is not the case - instead, they are appointed times. If you consider a watch and pick a time along the circumference of the watch you could say that is an appointed time. For example, you may have an appointment at 7:34. This is a recurring appointed time. Excellent post, silentknight! What wonderful insights! |
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Post by katmak on Sept 2, 2017 9:20:19 GMT -6
Wow, thank you sk! I join mike in simpleton village (Pop. 2) and am grateful for your insight and analysis.
In other news, I found this at the Hebrews4christians.com site and wondered if it holds any relevance to the topic:
"The shofar is also mentioned in connection with both Rosh Hashanah (Lev. 23:24, Num. 29:1) and the Yom Kippur Jubilee: "Then, on the tenth day of the seventh month, on Yom Kippur, you are to sound a blast on the shofar; you are to sound the shofar all through your land" (Lev. 25:9). In later Jewish history, since the shofar was sounded throughout the preceding month of Elul, the blowing of the shofar on the first of Tishri (i.e., Rosh Hashanah) was sometimes called "the last trump," while the shofar blast on Yom Kippur was called the "great trump," since at that time judgment was sealed."
i look forward to reading any thoughts on this, whether it's labeled completed baseless or otherwise.
many thanks to you learned scholars!
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Post by Natalie on Sept 2, 2017 9:53:44 GMT -6
I have heard it explained that way, too.
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Post by rt on Sept 2, 2017 21:34:17 GMT -6
I disagree, first of all the feasts could have multiple fulfillment, secondly the sign, at least in my opinion loses nothing, it is still a fulfillment of something prophetic that John describes in the Revelation, John never connects it with a holy day, and thus it is the fulfillment of the sign itself that packs the punch, whatever day it falls on.
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Post by rt on Sept 2, 2017 22:01:22 GMT -6
Wow, thank you sk! I join mike in simpleton village (Pop. 2) and am grateful for your insight and analysis. In other news, I found this at the Hebrews4christians.com site and wondered if it holds any relevance to the topic: "The shofar is also mentioned in connection with both Rosh Hashanah (Lev. 23:24, Num. 29:1) and the Yom Kippur Jubilee: "Then, on the tenth day of the seventh month, on Yom Kippur, you are to sound a blast on the shofar; you are to sound the shofar all through your land" (Lev. 25:9). In later Jewish history, since the shofar was sounded throughout the preceding month of Elul, the blowing of the shofar on the first of Tishri (i.e., Rosh Hashanah) was sometimes called "the last trump," while the shofar blast on Yom Kippur was called the "great trump," since at that time judgment was sealed." i look forward to reading any thoughts on this, whether it's labeled completed baseless or otherwise. many thanks to you learned scholars! So when we look at the scripture that talks about the rams horn being sounded on the day of Atonement, it is actually talking about the Sabbath years and the Jubilee. The shofar was not sounded every year on the day of atonement, but rather only at the Jubilee, to proclaim release through the land to all of its inhabitants. If you look at the other passages that talk about the way the day of atonement was to be observed, there is no mention of a ram's horn. Again it was the "silver trumpets" that were sounded at the appointed feasts not a ram's horn The silver trumpets were sounded as a reminder of the people before God Jesus is the one John tells us speaks with the voice of a trumpet Jesus is our "silver trumpet", who stands before God as a reminder of us before God, He is the head and we are His body, He summons us to gather, He will assemble us together before God's throne, He leads us, He is our defender in battle, He saves us from our enemies, He intercedes for us: |
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